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Opinion on Toon Up-less Toons

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Furious Feline, Aug 16, 2015.

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  1. Furious Feline

    Furious Feline Cog Crusher

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    First off, let me clear some things up. I am not here to bash anyone who chose not to have toon up. I have plenty of friends who chose against having it, and I bear no ill will towards them or any of you. Second, I have not been as active on these forums as I would have liked, so please forgive me if this is a common thread topic.

    Anyways, on to the subject at hand. As you all know, you can only have 6 of the 7 available gag tracks in toontown. Most people choose against either drop or trap, but you will see toons with many different combinations. For example, in TTO, my main was soundless. I later came to regret that decision after the countless times I had been excluded from groups simply because of my lack of sound. I learned not to repeat my mistake and chose it in TTR. Still, I kept Toon-Up and instead dropped Trap, as I had always hated training it. To be honest, it's almost 2 am where I live, and I'm mostly rambling, so let me try to get to the point. Whenever I see toons who have all 6 possible gag tracks and have found that they excluded Toon-Up, I get a strange feeling. I know that chances are they didn't mean anything by their decision, but it comes across as very selfish and uncaring. Again, not that they are, it just seems like it to me. I am usually hesitant to do a duo cog building with them, knowing that if anything goes wrong, i'm probably going sad. Still, at the same time, it almost creates a sort of class system in-game that is fairly interesting. In a regular (non-sound, as the class system is nullified as everyone only uses sound) four toon building, for example, every toon eventually carves a niche for themself. You have a healer (one who frequently toons up the toons, but also provides attack support), a stunner (someone who frequently uses lure and when the cogs are lured also helps with the attacks), and the fighters (these toons primarily use attack gags, all the ones not named toon up or lure). In this scenario, I have no problem with the toons who go TU-less. So, what are your opinions on toons that choose against Toon Up?
     
  2. southernbelle

    southernbelle Elite Toon

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    Toons should be able to pick whatever gags they want to have and not have. Toon up less toons should be more experienced players, otherwise the player just ends up greening everyone.
    TU-less was cool in TTO because not a lot of people did it, now it's like the third "leave off" option. I was lure less on TTO, still not too common. Soundless is still not common either.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  3. TheTabKey

    TheTabKey Elite Toon ATTA Supporter TTR Beta Tester

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    I think that from a truly strategically biased standpoint, you should have Toon-Up.

    From a more realistic perspective, you don't NEED Toon-Up. But at the same time, you don't NEED both Drop AND Trap.

    I feel like the whole TU-less, and Dropless vs Trapless discussions are one in the same.

    Is there ever a situation where you need both Trap AND Drop to warrant NOT having Toon-Up for the sake of your team?
    (Keep in mind, that this situation needs to happen more than how often you need Toon-Up, and it really needs to be a life saver, because that's what Toon-Up is for)

    My first ever character on TTO was a Toon-Upless, and I have plans to recreate him after I max out the Toon I'm on now, and I had a blast with him. But there were so many more situations where I wish I had Toon-Up to help my team compared to how many times I was glad I had Trap AND Drop.

    People seem to forget a lot of the time that the game is still something you have to play through, a lot of the posts I read saying "Toon-Upless is completely unnecessary" look at the game from a completely end-game perspective as if you had a full team of maxed players who are 100% strategically apt. That's unrealistic. Realistically, you are going to have players who make bad decisions in battle, you are going to have greeners, you will be unlucky and miss one too many gags, you will be with unexperienced toons, etc. And in all of those situations, Toon-Up has the potential to save your team from losing.

    Toon-Up is a fall back. It is not a necessary gag track in the same light you'd look at Throw, Sound, or Lure in. You can go an entire boss fight without needing to Toon-Up ONCE, and that's fine. That does not mean that Toon-Up is worthless. There are just as many (if not more) battles where you go without using Trap or Drop.

    On top of all of this, more often than not I noticed on my TU-less that the second people noticed I was TU-less, I would be replaced by someone else if they could. So many times I missed out on buildings or boss fights because my team felt I was unreliable. That sucks.

    Another misconception I've heard (a lot) is that players who feel safer with Toon-Up in their team feel like they need to constantly be at full laff to play the game. And I've met some players who literally panic and freak out at us when they were down just 20 laff, but that's just not true for all players. I feel safer with Toon-Up, because after I've been hit 3 or 4 times and I'm down to 12 laff, I really would like to be healed. No, I don't NEED to be, but one more hit and I'm dead. One missed throw gag and I'm dead. And THAT'S when Toon-Up is needed. That happens more often than people seem to give credit for.

    Playing Toon-Upless can be really fun though, and I really enjoyed my TU-less TTO rabbit! And I can't wait to play it again. TU-less people need to be treated with more general respect, but at the same time more "experienced" players look at them way too highly. Being TU-less does not immediately make you an amazing player, but it also does not immediately make you a terrible player.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2015
  4. Furious Feline

    Furious Feline Cog Crusher

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    Good response. I felt the same way as you when I didn't have sound (which was a bad idea). I also feel the same about TU, it's not going to be used all the time, but it definitely gives you peace of mind knowing if something goes wrong, you aren't done for.
     
  5. JazzMan

    JazzMan Elite Toon TTR Beta Tester

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    When I chose to become toonupless, I did not do so out of selfishness. I did it because I knew that was not necessary for EVERYONE to have toonup. I mean, if you were in a building with four people, and only three of them had toonup, you'd still be able to complete the building comfortably, right? So I thought, "Why add to the redundancy of toonup when I could have the two most powerful gag tracks?"

    In fact, toonupless toons are actually more selfless than trapless and dropless toons, because they have to endure training BOTH trap and drop, while dropless and trapless only have to train one of them (I did not come up with this argument, I read it somewhere on the forums. I think it was @Whens Dinner that came up with iti)

    Now I must admit that being toonupless does make duoing buildings tricky, but never has it been impossible for me. It just requires myself and the other person to have good strategy and plan things to minimize the damage inflicted by the cogs. And when someone's laff is dangeriously low, I was able to use SOS cards to toon them up.

    Please do not automatically label all toonupless toons as selfish and uncaring!
     
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  6. Beary Funny2

    Beary Funny2 Cog Crusher

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    It's not more selfless to train both trap and drop, it's just more boring. Been there done that.
     
  7. Lady Smarty

    Lady Smarty Hall of Fame Hall of Fame ATTA Supporter

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    Thank you @JazzMan! You said exactly what I was going to say. I have a toonupless toon. I have never once caused anyone to go sad because she doesn't have toonup.
     
  8. Fruity

    Fruity Cog Crusher

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    I'd pick squirtless if I could.
     
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  9. Furious Feline

    Furious Feline Cog Crusher

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    I hope you do not get the impression that I'm trying to stereotype all TU-less toons, I tried to make it clear in my first post. While I can't say it's selfless to have both trap and drop, it does require a lot of patience, as training them was/is near torture!
     
  10. I don't see anything wrong with toon up less toons, as long as at least 2 people per battle have toon up you are fine. Plus, they can dish out lots of damage with not just their drop, but they also will have trap (as said above its either one or the other)
     
  11. Puzzler

    Puzzler Elite Toon KTTA ATTA Supporter TTR Beta Tester

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    Toon-Upless toons are NOT selfish. Every gag track has its own use, and it's likely toons who choose to not have Toon-Up are going more for offense than defense. They get way too much of a bad rep.

    Also, taking from what JazzMan said...
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2015
  12. Usagi Yojimbo

    Usagi Yojimbo Gag Trainer

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    Nah, I don't think it's selfish. Usagi is toonup-less and it's cool. B)
    You just gotta stock up on SOS. And in TTO a maxed doodle meant you basically had toon-up anyway. I think it's a real bummer that toonup-less toons get all this hate. Lots of people seem to assume that they're selfish and try to leave them out whenever possible even though most toonup-less toons are skilled players that have a good understanding of how to keep others happy without toon-up.
     
  13. snowshoes

    snowshoes Cog Crusher ATTA Supporter TTR Beta Tester

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    I have no problem with toonup-less toons. We all miss out one track and I have no problem with anyone's choices.
     
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  14. Crazy Felix Zoobleburger

    Crazy Felix Zoobleburger Cog Crusher

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    Everybody will be able to toonup anyways with the rerelease of doodles.
     
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  15. affiniteas

    affiniteas Elite Toon ATTA Supporter TTR Beta Tester

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    I don't have a problem with toons that choose not to go with toon-up, but if we're doing a boss battle I wouldn't allow more than two to a group for obvious reasons. Again, I don't have a problem with toons that don't have toon-up, but others do. You wouldn't believe how many toon-up less toons I invite to boarding groups with all maxed tracks and 100+ laff that get kicked in favor of someone weaker and with only 2 maxed tracks because everyone is so scared of dying.
     
  16. Unfulfilled

    Unfulfilled Elite Toon ATTA Supporter TTR Beta Tester

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    I mean like, I've done a ceo with 5/8 Tu-less toons and it went smoothly. Very early in the battle, someone got disconnected and then we had 5/7 Tu-less toons. The main reason why it went so well is because we were communicating and we all had maxed gags. Plus, when someone got hit, a toon yelled out "I'll use lure" and then I would say "I'll use a Flippy". At the end of the day, tu sos, and tu unites are a thing. I don't need the gag track lol.
     
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  17. Agreed. As long as we retain a good strategy, playing smart will always outweigh playing poorly and easily being able to fix our mistakes.
     
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  18. Mae Borowski

    Mae Borowski Cog Crusher TTR Beta Tester

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    If every player on toontown knew good strategy and generally had good smarts and common sense, there would really be no reason for toonup.
    However, that's not the case because even if you've had a good streak with battles, some greener or incompetent toon comes along and utterly wrecks your team.
    Also, we can't forget that sometimes, gags MISS (gasp). Sometimes ALL the gags miss. When group lures or sounds miss in a high cog area, the effects are typically devastating. It only takes about four power hits to make a 100 laffer go sad. If everyone's toonupless in an all gags miss scenario, unless you have toonup sos's.... Yeah your done. Rip

    Point is, toonup is a safety net for when things go wrong. And come on, we all know sometimes, thing go wrong.

    What does this have to do with toonupless toons?

    Well, they make the game challenging. Not for them self, rather, everyone else around them. Do they come off as selfish? No. Do they come off as an idiot with little to no strategy? They can, but so can everyone else. (Although if you have a group with at least 2 toons with toonup, there's really nothing to worry about.)

    Point is, nothing is wrong with toonupless toons. Whats wrong is when people shun and discriminate them. Give the person a chance. Don't judge someone based on what gag track they didn't choose.

    And if you are going toonupless, it'd be smart to bring alot of toonup sos's and have a well trained doodle (if they EVER COME OUT on ttr). Also, organic lure is also a good option so you can lure and let other toons heal the team.
     
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  19. Prof. Skids

    Prof. Skids Cog Crusher KTTA ATTA Supporter TTR Beta Tester

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    The reason why I went Toon-Up less was cause when I max my Toon, soloing anything will be easier cause you won't have a useless gag track when you are by yourself. I'm not saying Toon-Up is useless at all, it just is when there is nobody to Toon.
     
  20. Satorus

    Satorus Guest

    It doesn't really matter what gag track you don't have because I learned something today. You can just stock up on SOS cards in that track.
     
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